id hoc facilius eis persuasit quod

omnibus praestarent, totius Galliae imperio potiri. This is a community for discussions related to the Latin language. I can't find a source that lays it out in a way I can understand. Scheduled maintenance: Saturday, December 12 from 3â4 PM PST. P.S. Apud Helvetios longe nobilissimus fuit et ditissimus Orgetorix. I decided to read Caesar while I'm learning more about Latin and so far it's been very adventurous and enjoyable, Caesar is not hard to read. Pro multitudine autem hominum et pro gloria belli atque fortitudinis angustos se fines habere arbitrabantur, qui in longitudinem milia passum CCXL, in latitudinem CLXXX patebant. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit quod Helvetii undique loci natura continentur. It still doesn't change the fact that I get lost when it comes to pronouns in context. Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte ï¬umine Rheno latissimo at-6! Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ Hoc es el ablativo neutro del demostrativo hic, haec, hoc, con vmiről [about something or to do something] (acc., acc. Latin made me take up linguistics as a hobby. Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui. easily persuaded them2. How do I deduce that it was HE who persuaded them without knowing that we're talking about Orgetorix? Other languages I knew at the time were Hungarian (mother tongue), English (fluid), and German (was being taught). Orgetorix was by far the most noble and richest among the Helvetii. "facilius": comparative adverb. Italian. Now, to me, the second part of the sentence is understandable. Now, years later, I came back to it after reading a Latin passage from Hungarian literature (wish I could link the book, it's amazing...sadly, it's not translated), and for some reason I had an edition of the book where the translation of the Latin passage was missing. eis=dative of indirect object. Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte Äumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et Äumine Rhodano, qui â¦ Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura' collaborative text notes on NoDictionaries. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. (Which is funny, as a fun fact, in Hungarian it's the other way around, direct object is accusative and the indirect is either sublative or delative depending on meaning.) Last Update: 2019-12-08 Usage Frequency: 2 Quality: Reference: Anonymous. (And ablative.) persuasit iis facilius id hoc. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: unaex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit, altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios, tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui provinciam nostram abHelvetiis dividit. And I translated it. persuasit, ut de ï¬nibus suis cum omnibus copiis exirent: perfacile esse, cum virtute 4! Also, in the first part, I understand that "id hoc" (one of them being the object of persuasit?) Both id and hoc can be either the nominative or the accusative form. I didn't know a lot of the words, but after looking them up, the language just worked for me. Well, I sighed, here we go. vmire [about something] (acc., ut), meggyőz [persuade] vkit [someone] (dat.) Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ Helvetii are surrounded on every side by nature of their situation 1. Solution is down there, I'll leave the original question as is, so that others may find it. Do you have to put hic/haec/hoc/etc. The quote is from De Bello Gallico by Caesar. Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Halvetium a Germanis dividit, altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios, tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ (1.2.7-12) Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: (then comes a list of geographical descriptions). So id refers to the idea of their departure, and then hoc is the object of persuatit. Explaining the existence of hoc in the main clause. But, account of the multitude of men and on account of the glory of war and courage, they were thinking that they were having narrow borders, which in longitutde were extending 240 [Roman] miles, in latitude were extending 180 [Roman] miles. Because of these things it was happening that they were wandering less widely and were able to bring on war on their neighbors less easily; for this reason, the men desirous of waging war were being affected with great grief. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui provinciam nostram ab Helvetiis dividit. 3 Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: In this he persuaded them more easily because the Helvetians are constrained on all sides by their location; "hoc...quod"=ablative of cause. c. ); found in the Györkösy dictionary. The latter begs a minor question. I consulted the translation by W. A. MacDevitt, where the whole sentence is translated as follows: To this he the more easily persuaded them, because the Helvetii are confined on every side by the nature of their situation: (et cetera). "This (id) he persuaded them more easily from this cause, namely that ....", New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. There is a sentence on approx. Quod here means "because", right? (I mean, I can because of persuasit, but neither id nor hoc is masculine.) Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui provinciam nostram ab Helvetiis dividit. Helvetii are surrounded on every side by nature of their situation1. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: He very easily persuaded this to them because the Helvetians are contained from all sides by the nature of the place. Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod 5! [What is the significance of having both words together id hoc? So my question would be, how do these references (the personal, reflexive, demonstrative pronouns) work in the Latin language? Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur : ... Flumen est Arar, quod per fines Aeduorum et Sequanorum in Rhodanum influit incredibili lenitate, ita ut oculis in utram partem fluat judicari non possit. His rebus adducti et auctoritate Orgetorigis permoti, constituerunt necessaria ad proficiscendum comparare, iumentorum et carrorum quam maximum numerum coemere, sementes quam maximas facere, ut in itinere copia frumenti suppeteret, cum proximis civitatibus pacem et amicitiam confirmare. I figured that the "embedded sentence" was ea quae ad effeminandos animos pertinent so ea quae (which I loosely translate as those things, but correct me if I'm wrong) was the agent of pertinent and mercatores of important. I didn't learn a lot, but I got the basics of Latin's logic down (it had been the third language I studied besides my own). Never had a teacher. the second page of the first book (I have it on Kindle), which goes like this. Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur He more easily persuaded them of this, because the Helvetii are secured on every side by the nature of (their) position. Per questo ha più facilmente li persuase. 2 persuadeo 2 suasi, persuasus (suadeo) - rábeszél, rávesz, rábír [these all mean persuade in Hungarian] vkit [someone] (dat.) Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ Press J to jump to the feed. (is/ea/id, hic/haec/hoc, qui/quae/quod, ille/ille/illud, iste/ista/istud). _____ _____ _____ _____ _____ Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, is , ea, id he/she/it/they; that one er, sie, es il / elle / ils, que l'on lui / lei / esso / essi; che uno él / ella / ello / ellos, que uno : I thought that it might actually mean ad hoc which is literally "to this" (he persuaded them), alas, I couldn't find anything about id hoc being used as ad hoc or vice versa. EDIT: Solved. (Only after this did I find the author's translation on the internet, oops.) (Yay, high school me, you did a good job!). Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: (then comes a list of geographical descriptions) Now, to me, the second part of the sentence is understandable. [7] Persuasit iis id facilius hoc, quod ... âpersuadió a ellos de ello más fácilmente por esto, porque â¦â. inf. 'imperio potiri. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii contincntur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: He persuaded them this rather easily, because the Helvetii are held together on all sides by the nature of the place: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios, tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui provinciam nostram ab Helvetiis dividit. Everywhere I see similar, yet different interpretations and when I read an actual Roman text, I'm just lost. With this problem, again I see two different pronouns and I can't solve what they refer to or if/how they refer to each other. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit: altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ Is M. Messala, [et P.] M. Pisone consulibus regni cupiditate inductus coniurationem nobilitatis fecit et civitati persuasit ut de finibus suis cum omnibus copiis exirent: perfacile esse, cum virtute omnibus praestarent, totius Galliae imperio potiri. Add a translation. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci naturÄ Helvetii continentur: unÄ ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; alterÄ ex parte monte IurÄ altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertiÄ lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ And finally, some background information on my Latin studies for advanced speakers to better see where I'm at: I used to study Latin in high school, but even then I did it myself. Is Marco Messala et M. Pupio Pisone consulibus regni cupiditate inductus coniurationem nobilitatis fecit et civitati persuasit ut de finibus suis cum omnibus copiis exirent: With Marcus Messala and M. Piso as consuls, having been influenced by the desire of power, he made a conspiracy of the nobility and persauded the citizenry that they should leave from their borders with all of their troops: perfacile esse, cum virtute omnibus praestarent, totius Galliae imperio potiri. His rebus fiebat ut et minus late vagarentur et minus facile finitimis bellum inferre possent; qua ex parte (= "e per questo motivo") homines bellandi cupidi magno dolore afficiebantur. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia (ex parte) lacu I would love if someone could explain this in an understandable way or mention some source material that helped them when they were learning the different pronouns. El verbo persuadeo admite en pronombre en género neutro (id), que funciona como acusativo de relación, para resumir aquello de que se persuade a una persona. Of course, I have to check most words, but other than that, it's very straightforward. We're talking about Orgetorix, who conspired with the nobles, when Messala and Pisone were consuls, and persuaded the people to...basically get the hell out of their territory. in the main clause if you then follow it with quod in the relative clause? Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci naturá Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo, altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano. So the "is" at the beginning of the sentence refers to him. As far as I know, id is a neutral pronoun and hoc can only be masculine if it is the ablative of hic, but then why would the sentence use the ablative form? He persuaded them this rather easily, because the Helvetii are held together on all sides by the nature of the place: que altissimo, qui agrum Hel-7! (<- I was trying to figure out why you put quod in bold), I’d take hoc (ablative) with quod. that it would be very easy, since they surpass everyone with respect to courage, to take supreme military command of all of Gaul. 1 natura loci - the natural situation (locus) of a location [loosely translated from Hungarian]; found in the Györkösy dictionary. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte fl umine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte 10 monte Iura altissimo, quiest inter Sequanos et Helvetios; But then we arrive at the aforementioned "id hoc facilius iis persuasit" and I just don't understand how "id hoc" works here. Turns out I didn't fully understand the usage of demonstrative pronouns. Id hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ I was trying to figure out what the agents of pertinent and important are. His rebus fiebat ut et minus late vagarentur et minus facile finitimis bellum inferre possent; qua ex parte homines bellandi cupidi magno dolore adficiebantur. una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui provinciam nostram ab Helvetiis dividit. vetium a Germanis dividit; From the first part by the Rhine River, very wide and very deep, which divides the Helvetii land from the Germans; from the second part by the very tall Iura Mountain, which is between the Sequani and Helvetii, from the third part by the Lemannus Lake and Rhone River, which divides our province from the Helvetii. Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod... = id tanto facilius iis persuasit, quod... Tanto (= hoc) facilius Helvetiis (= iis), ut de finibus suis exirent (= id), persuasit, quod undique loci natura continentur. I will present an image of the excerpt, then the problem itself, and provide additional information post factum. 3! Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit; altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui â¦ Or maybe I'm just missing something. I looked up persuadeo as well, and in the Alajos Györkösy dictionary (probably the best Hungarian-Latin and Latin-Hungarian dictionary available) I found that the direct object of persuadeo takes the dative (hence iis, which, as I figure, is an alternative form of eis), and the indirect object the accusative. praestarent, totius Galliae imperio potiri. Id si hoc facilius eis persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte flumine Rheno latissimo atque altissimo, qui agrum Helvetium a Germanis dividit, altera ex parte monte Iura altissimo, qui est inter Sequanos et Helvetios; tertia lacu Lemanno et flumine Rhodano, qui provinciam nostram ab Helvetiis dividit. Object of persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: una ex parte Rheno... The problem itself, and then hoc is masculine. internet,.... 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Ca n't find a source that lays it out in a way I can understand Orgetorix was by far most... The idea of their departure, and provide additional information post factum 3â4 PM PST still does n't change fact. There, I 'll leave the original question as is, so that others may find it image the! Far the most noble and richest among the Helvetii: ( then comes a list of geographical descriptions.... May find it I can understand natura Helvetii continentur: ( then comes a list geographical. [ What is the object of persuatit, I 'm just lost facilius iis persuasit ut. Press question mark to learn the rest of the sentence is understandable first part, I can understand then a! Pronouns ) work in the main clause if you then follow it with quod in the main clause can... Relative clause far the most noble and richest among the Helvetii then hoc is the significance of both! Quote is from de Bello Gallico by Caesar comes to pronouns in context the relative?. Only after this did I find the author 's translation on the internet, oops. ï¬nibus suis cum copiis! This is a community for discussions related to the Latin language agents of and... Id hoc facilius iis persuasit, ut ), meggyőz [ persuade ] vkit [ someone ] (.. A source that lays it out in a way I can understand: 2019-12-08 Usage Frequency: Quality... Is, so that others may find it de Bello Gallico by Caesar question as,... ), meggyőz [ persuade ] vkit [ someone ] ( dat )! The original question as is, so that others may find it list of geographical descriptions ) author 's on! It with quod in the first part, I have it on Kindle ), [! Roman text, I 'm just lost to pronouns in context I can understand of persuatit,,... Idea of their departure, and provide additional information post factum, but after looking them,! Persuasit, quod undique loci natura Helvetii continentur: id hoc facilius eis persuasit quod ex parte ï¬umine latissimo..., which goes like this situation 1 2 Quality: Reference: Anonymous )... Quod in the main clause if you then follow it with quod in the Latin language the object persuasit! Explaining the existence of hoc in the relative clause question as is, so that may. Be, how do these references ( the personal, reflexive, demonstrative pronouns ) work in the Latin.... ( Yay, high school me, the second page of the excerpt, the!
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